New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

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New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

nisma
Hi, i´m working on a new autopilot fork adding gps, and spi memory. I´m actually thinking about adding relative pressure sensor.

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Re: New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

Tilman Baumann-3
Cool.
Can you maybe get rid of that seven way molex on the side as well and  
spilt it into power  and CAN and whatever is on there.
On 10 May 2013, at 16:41, [hidden email] wrote:

> Hi, i´m working on a new autopilot fork adding gps, and spi memory. I
> ´m actually thinking about adding relative pressure sensor.
> _______________________________________________
> Paparazzi-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/paparazzi-devel


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Re: New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

nisma
I´m have done LIA, it´s  near complete. Now i´m beginning with LISA, same size of LIA, bigger as actual lisaM.
Do you have other wishes ? Is someone on the list willing to test the board ?
 
Differnces to previous LIA:
MPU-9150 footprint inside ASPIRIN footprint.
PA6H GPS module including external Antenna added.
Xbee socket added.
possibly to reflow micro-SD card on the pcb.
Improvements on powering section.
 
TODO:
remove USB connector.
add usb protection circuit.
Added RS485 as lower cost bus option or instead of can

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Re: New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

Piotr Esden-Tempski-2
Hi,

A few random comments.

On May 12, 2013, at 8:59 AM, [hidden email] wrote:

> I´m have done LIA, it´s  near complete. Now i´m beginning with LISA, same size of LIA, bigger as actual lisaM.
> Do you have other wishes ? Is someone on the list willing to test the board ?
>  
> Differnces to previous LIA:
> MPU-9150 footprint inside ASPIRIN footprint.
Don't forget baro. And also be careful with that ... please don't bring back the i2c nightmare! Also reading out all the sensors with i2c will be probably at least on the verge of impossibility and will force you to use the invensense motion engine. Consider designing towards MPU-9250.

> PA6H GPS module including external Antenna added.
> Xbee socket added.
I have not seen your design. But that sounds like a big space waste on the board.
> possibly to reflow micro-SD card on the pcb.
Good idea. Think about manufacturability...
> Improvements on powering section.
What does that mean? :)
>  
> TODO:
> remove USB connector.
Why?
> add usb protection circuit.
What do you mean? If you mean ESD protection, then I think that is totally unnecessary in this application and just waste of space and weight. If you mean reverse voltage protection, please elaborate.
> Added RS485 as lower cost bus option or instead of can
I hope you mean ADD and not replace. CAN vs RS485 transceiver price difference is almost negligible. About 4cents a peace at 100 pcs... having a well defined protocol with filtering options and built in collision avoidance vs a custom protocol is in my opinion a better choice in most cases. But correct me if I am wrong.

As I did not see your designs take my comments with a grain of salt. :) Sorry if I missed a link to your github or something. Are you putting them somewhere?

Good luck with your project.

Cheers Piotr
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Re: New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

Tilman Baumann-3
Thanks Piotr. You are pointing out a few really good questions which I  
had not even noticed.
Especially USB and CAN. Why?

On 12 May 2013, at 20:21, Piotr Esden-Tempski wrote:

> Hi,
>
> A few random comments.
>
> On May 12, 2013, at 8:59 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
>> I´m have done LIA, it´s  near complete. Now i´m beginning with  
>> LISA, same size of LIA, bigger as actual lisaM.
>> Do you have other wishes ? Is someone on the list willing to test  
>> the board ?
>>
>> Differnces to previous LIA:
>> MPU-9150 footprint inside ASPIRIN footprint.
> Don't forget baro. And also be careful with that ... please don't  
> bring back the i2c nightmare! Also reading out all the sensors with  
> i2c will be probably at least on the verge of impossibility and will  
> force you to use the invensense motion engine. Consider designing  
> towards MPU-9250.
>
>> PA6H GPS module including external Antenna added.
>> Xbee socket added.
> I have not seen your design. But that sounds like a big space waste  
> on the board.
>> possibly to reflow micro-SD card on the pcb.
> Good idea. Think about manufacturability...
>> Improvements on powering section.
> What does that mean? :)
>>
>> TODO:
>> remove USB connector.
> Why?
>> add usb protection circuit.
> What do you mean? If you mean ESD protection, then I think that is  
> totally unnecessary in this application and just waste of space and  
> weight. If you mean reverse voltage protection, please elaborate.
>> Added RS485 as lower cost bus option or instead of can
> I hope you mean ADD and not replace. CAN vs RS485 transceiver price  
> difference is almost negligible. About 4cents a peace at 100 pcs...  
> having a well defined protocol with filtering options and built in  
> collision avoidance vs a custom protocol is in my opinion a better  
> choice in most cases. But correct me if I am wrong.
>
> As I did not see your designs take my comments with a grain of  
> salt. :) Sorry if I missed a link to your github or something. Are  
> you putting them somewhere?
>
> Good luck with your project.
>
> Cheers Piotr
> _______________________________________________
> Paparazzi-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/paparazzi-devel


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Re: New Autopilot board, lia/lisaM fork.

nisma
In reply to this post by Piotr Esden-Tempski-2
Yes, MPU-9250 is on the wish list and i have made the board with this sensor in mind, but want have a prototype with the i2c part, that is
available now.  I want evaluate the performance of the desing and it´s impact to GPS, XBEE, ADC and to the IMU itself.
LIA is actually designed as 2 layer, it should be easy to convert it to 4 layer if necessary.
 
Xbee socket was initially not on the design list, it was a idea during routing. It fits nicely, and only destroy the really nice screen printing on
the real Lea. I prefer having the Xbee Socket instead of the screen printing. Eventually onle 4 pins for mechanical stability and 4 pins electrical remain,
as for now, the full xbee footprint is planned.
 
Powering section:
Mosfet on/off switch,  possibility to attach failsafe battery, support for 6.6V LiFePO4 servos.
 
Manufacturability:
soldering SD cards on PCB is possible, placing it with P&P too and there are some usb flash card around that are made in this manner.
It must be glued on the pcb, like the GPS module and this side must be assembled first.
The downside is, if the Flash dies, it cannot be replaced or fitted afterwards.
 
 
RS485:
depending on the remaining size, either additional or as replacement to can,  can bus will remain.
RS485 for two reasons, digital servos that gives back torque and that work on 2S lipos without needing BEC.
It´s a nice to heave feature, but having only 3x RS232, 1 for GPS, 1 for Modem, 1 for MBUS, there is no space for other,
so ATTiny85 is needed in order to act as bridge for i2c and M-BUS (Multiplex Sensor Bus), the next nice to have feature.
No, seriosly, the 2 layer are test projects. So the other reason is, if 2 layer and GPS/RF/... don´t work reliable compared to the 4Layer version,
then i want using the board otherwise, as RS485 Logger or DMX controller, Can to Modbus Gateway, 
IF it don´t work as

USB:
On LIA/LISA, actually all connectors are on top. With the gps addition, only the gps module, sd-card, leds, some servo transistor/mosfets
and resistors/... are on top, the connectors need to be mounted on bottom. This implies that i don´t have space for the usb connector, at
least now. The USB cable should be possible to seldered on the PCB.
Further i want use a min jack, these intendet for video, 4 pol as usb/rs232 communication port. This is the reason why i consider adding
either PESD5V/12V or PRTR5V , depending of the available space and overall price. This as footprint, it don´t tell it must be assembled.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
> MPU-9150 footprint inside ASPIRIN footprint.
Don't forget baro. And also be careful with that ... please don't bring back the i2c nightmare! Also reading out all the sensors with i2c will be probably at least on the verge of impossibility and will force you to use the invensense motion engine. Consider designing towards MPU-9250.
 
> PA6H GPS module including external Antenna added.
> Xbee socket added.
I have not seen your design. But that sounds like a big space waste on the board.
> possibly to reflow micro-SD card on the pcb.
Good idea. Think about manufacturability...
> Improvements on powering section.
What does that mean? :)
>
> TODO:
> remove USB connector.
Why?
> add usb protection circuit.
What do you mean? If you mean ESD protection, then I think that is totally unnecessary in this application and just waste of space and weight. If you mean reverse voltage protection, please elaborate.
> Added RS485 as lower cost bus option or instead of can
I hope you mean ADD and not replace. CAN vs RS485 transceiver price difference is almost negligible. About 4cents a peace at 100 pcs... having a well defined protocol with filtering options and built in collision avoidance vs a custom protocol is in my opinion a better choice in most cases. But correct me if I am wrong.

As I did not see your designs take my comments with a grain of salt. :) Sorry if I missed a link to your github or something. Are you putting them somewhere?

Good luck with your project.

Cheers Piotr
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